Strange, it's for that reason that my parents don't vote democrat -- they think the dems make decisions with their emotions without regard to viable policy.
TIMM
· 1 year ago
@ Zealot,
No, it's not strange. That's experience.
@ Daniel,
I wonder how many emotions using that photoshopped picture is meant to evoke.
As to the passage you quote,
"Often, my haste is a mistake, but I live with the consequences without complaint."
That is something to respect.
-=T=-
shane
· 1 year ago
I bet Obama would agree with McCain actually. Leaders should listen to many options and contemplate on their consequences but at some point need to make a decision. Most of the options are already well thought out by advisers and committees. But a leader needs to make a decision and stand by it through thick and thin. A decision may be a mistake and then you own up to it (as the Bush administration has failed to do many times). It is not a knock against McCain for having that quality and I'm glad that Obama has it as well.
I'm pretty sure you won't buy my next argument but here goes: Sometimes following through with a poor decision (a decision that produces results you didn't expect) is better than scrapping your first plan half-way after you already poured lots of effort into it, to then start a new plan that will inevitably have its own hidden consequences. The people shouldn't expect a perfect presidential decision, they should expect that they made the best decision based on the information they had at the time (information that is not always released to the public).
CarlM
· 1 year ago
@TIMM
“Often, my haste is a mistake, but I live with the consequences without complaint.” That is something to respect.
... well ... in my opinion we were too hasty in going in to Iraq. Had that been better thought out, we'd have easier consequences to live with. That's the sort of thing that comes to my mind when I see a quote like McCain's.
@shane
You made a point that isn't made often enough (and you hid it in parentheses). Important information that top-level decisions are based on is not always available to the public. There needs to be a certain level of trust in the government. Part of building that trust is owning up to mistakes and showing that you learned from them and are concerned by them.
I think that the reason that McCain's quote strikes aome as a little frightening is that it comes across as "Yeah, I often make mistakes, but it's no big deal. I don't worry about it. I just roll with it and move on." There SEEMS to be an implication that the mistakes don't concern him. MISTAKES SHOULD CONCERN HIM. Everyone makes mistakes. It's important not to be paralyzed by indecision. But it is also important to be concerned when mistakes are made and to make a SERIOUS effort to learn from them and not repeat them. (The quote doesn't say that McCain disagrees with any of this, but it's phrased in such a way that it comes across as being uncaring about mistakes.)
shane
· 1 year ago
@Carl
Good point. My point is that sometimes leaders need to project the image that they can do no wrong (projecting that image through the media, speeches, books, ...) but behind closed doors they are allowed to hesitate, second guess, flip-flop, and get worried about making important decisions. Most intellectuals see through the false image but also should also realize that there are no perfect decisions.
"Part of building that trust is owning up to mistakes and showing that you learned from them and are concerned by them." That works for some people, but others would rather trust a guy more when they believe that he didn't actually make a mistake. I would rather know that a mistake has been made, but I also realize that a leader coming out to admit it can damage the country's reputation and respect. (I sound like a conservative elitist... is that a new species?)
After thinking more about that TED video from Jonathan Haidt about the psychological differences between cons and libs, I think that McCain was appealing to the cons' respect for authority. I think many conservatives want to believe that McCain isn't wishy washy; that he knows what he wants, makes his decision and stands by it. Haidt's video claims that most liberals question authority, but then again would be less likely to read his book anyways. I do not however think that McCain is actually careless enough to not be concerned about making mistakes.
All Comments
Strange, it's for that reason that my parents don't vote democrat -- they think the dems make decisions with their emotions without regard to viable policy.
@ Zealot,
No, it's not strange. That's experience.
@ Daniel,
I wonder how many emotions using that photoshopped picture is meant to evoke.
As to the passage you quote,
"Often, my haste is a mistake, but I live with the consequences without complaint."
That is something to respect.
-=T=-
I bet Obama would agree with McCain actually. Leaders should listen to many options and contemplate on their consequences but at some point need to make a decision. Most of the options are already well thought out by advisers and committees. But a leader needs to make a decision and stand by it through thick and thin. A decision may be a mistake and then you own up to it (as the Bush administration has failed to do many times). It is not a knock against McCain for having that quality and I'm glad that Obama has it as well.
I'm pretty sure you won't buy my next argument but here goes: Sometimes following through with a poor decision (a decision that produces results you didn't expect) is better than scrapping your first plan half-way after you already poured lots of effort into it, to then start a new plan that will inevitably have its own hidden consequences. The people shouldn't expect a perfect presidential decision, they should expect that they made the best decision based on the information they had at the time (information that is not always released to the public).
@TIMM
“Often, my haste is a mistake, but I live with the consequences without complaint.”
That is something to respect.
... well ... in my opinion we were too hasty in going in to Iraq. Had that been better thought out, we'd have easier consequences to live with. That's the sort of thing that comes to my mind when I see a quote like McCain's.
@shane
You made a point that isn't made often enough (and you hid it in parentheses). Important information that top-level decisions are based on is not always available to the public. There needs to be a certain level of trust in the government. Part of building that trust is owning up to mistakes and showing that you learned from them and are concerned by them.
I think that the reason that McCain's quote strikes aome as a little frightening is that it comes across as "Yeah, I often make mistakes, but it's no big deal. I don't worry about it. I just roll with it and move on." There SEEMS to be an implication that the mistakes don't concern him. MISTAKES SHOULD CONCERN HIM. Everyone makes mistakes. It's important not to be paralyzed by indecision. But it is also important to be concerned when mistakes are made and to make a SERIOUS effort to learn from them and not repeat them. (The quote doesn't say that McCain disagrees with any of this, but it's phrased in such a way that it comes across as being uncaring about mistakes.)
@Carl
Good point. My point is that sometimes leaders need to project the image that they can do no wrong (projecting that image through the media, speeches, books, ...) but behind closed doors they are allowed to hesitate, second guess, flip-flop, and get worried about making important decisions. Most intellectuals see through the false image but also should also realize that there are no perfect decisions.
"Part of building that trust is owning up to mistakes and showing that you learned from them and are concerned by them." That works for some people, but others would rather trust a guy more when they believe that he didn't actually make a mistake. I would rather know that a mistake has been made, but I also realize that a leader coming out to admit it can damage the country's reputation and respect. (I sound like a conservative elitist... is that a new species?)
After thinking more about that TED video from Jonathan Haidt about the psychological differences between cons and libs, I think that McCain was appealing to the cons' respect for authority. I think many conservatives want to believe that McCain isn't wishy washy; that he knows what he wants, makes his decision and stands by it. Haidt's video claims that most liberals question authority, but then again would be less likely to read his book anyways. I do not however think that McCain is actually careless enough to not be concerned about making mistakes.